LAYOUT PETITION: Status: CLOSED - Trimble Response Posted May 27th

Yes AK_SAM,
That is exactly the orientation and goal that Trimble must have for improving LayOut! The fact that most of us are not at all sure where Trimble is really focused is the problem.
If they intend to quietly abandon LO, I wish they would have the common decency to TELL us! Many of us AEC professionals have invested greatly in trying to use LO effectively, we rely on the functionality it does have, and desperately want it to improve!
Trimble needs to tell us - are they going to seriously invest in LayOut, or not? If not, please be honest with us, so that we can (reluctantly) move on!

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The subscription is purely a matter of profit and avoids developing software, since it is no longer necessary to retain customers. It is enough to see how other software are further improved without being in subscription.

Google brought for example the display engine in SketchUp which allows to display large models, dimensions in Layout, solids, dynamic components (which were anyway an independent Ruby development and therefore no “mess” in the code…)…
Hard to believe since the acquisition by Trimble, after 10 years.
In addition, some unfortunate “improvements” have been introduced (including in the latest version), which are meaningless and degrade the software experience since 15 years.

By the way, about BIM and AEC, I learned that a major construction company in Europe is developing software in great secrecy.

no roadmap?
mmrrbbuulll

No, but I can give you mine :slight_smile:

PM sent!

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Here’s a (probably) really wacky idea.

I think of Layout as a special kind of desktop publishing. Just like DP, you can pull in images, blocks of text, etc. What you can’t get is the dynamic connection to SU.

Arguably, the most useful function of LO is the ability to dimension SU models. But you can dimension things in SU. If the dimensioning abilities of SU were better, might it be possible to export SU data to DP software and harness the ready made capabilities of that to pull in image details, add text, etc? In short, why reinvent the wheel?

This might not work out of the box, but external renderers must know how to take SU data and make use of it. So why not other software?

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Asking for the impossible. Layout is pathetic in comparison to the cadd program (2D Mac only) PowerCadd which I have used for 31 years. Yesterday the developer, Todd Stanley, announced that it has no future, there will be no further development, this is an incredible shame. PowerCadd shares with SketchUp the elegance and ease of use we all have come to expect.
I do not know anything about coding but I do know elegance when I see it.
In my perfect world Trimble would acquire PowerCadd (at the moment it has no value) and would then begin to marry it to SketchUp with all its incredible features. I know that this is asking for the impossible but if you don’t believe in the impossible how do you ever expect it to happen.

SketchUp is amazing but what is lacking is the simplicity and ease of creating 2D drawing and Layout does not do it. This is based on the experience of producing 2D drawing for 31 years. I have been going between the two using .dwg export and import but it is not perfect.

I am available to answer any queries.
Rik Negus

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Great insight Rik! Yea reach out to me, let’s chat. Shoot me a message and I’ll send you my email.

I will join the secret discussion:

I talked to my mother yesterday. (I whispered something to her, but I didn’t send her an email nor private or direct message.)

:stuck_out_tongue:

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😂

Well, what did you say?

My mom said I can’t tell anyone because it’s secret.

:closed_lock_with_key:

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HOW TO MAKE LAYOUT FASTER:

I’m running into this layout speed thing again… I have a fast computer setup, it’s not totally top of the line, but it’s 48gb ram, radeon rx 580 graphics, 2 nocturo cooling fans (not water cooled), a 8700 coffee lake cpu running at 5ghz. I know I have a good setup, I’ll be improving my graphics and ram at some point to be even better, but it’s good enough…

I can’t express how important and insightful this video is that talks about how to really get the most out of layout speed. I have seen this video before, actually twice. Now this is my 3rd time tonight. I was so upset by how slow layout has been acting for me tonight that when I came acrross this video again, I checked some settings of mine and had my settings wrong… Turns out once I fixed my settings according to this video, display resolution, auto render box off, etc, layout is WAYYYYYYYYYY faster, it’s quite fast and it’s quite snappy. I must often forget to not have these settings set or my template system is messed up and unoroganized on my end. I also think it helps to know how much useage you’re computer is getting. I am not a computer whiz, but I know that if my computer is on too long during the day, especially for those of you that have there computer on for more than a day (which I rarely do) restarting your computer can give it a great performance boost for many more hours of the day, so you can try that, and also try to be mindful of how many heavy ram intensive programs you have open, even a ton of google chrome tabs might make an impact too, especially youtube tabs or media intensive. Really worth it to give this video a watch and watch it again if you’ve already seen it and check those settings in layout and what you’re doing on your computer while using Layout. I actually have to say that I’m shocked how fast and snappy it is when I do all this (again) hopefully I’ll remember to do this more often now.

I hope this helps a number of people out.

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Hi Rik,
I have also been at this “2D” Construction Drawing thing for at least 30 years, and I totally agree with your approach and idea …
Anyone who tries to use LayOut to produce Construction Documents at any scale knows we need serious improvements to stay competitive in today’s environment.
Trimble has clearly shown little interest to date in really making any serious investment in the LayOut program that would bring it up to current industry production standards. (Yes, there was the recent LayOut Petition, … but is there any tangible outcome or commitment from Trimble?)
So, if they can’t, and/or won’t improve LayOut , then PLEASE Trimble, let in someone or some other program (such as PowerCadd) that could solve this substantial, long standing, and built-in, production bottleneck.
Let’s hope someone at Trimble is actually paying attention to this discussion/thread. And let’s further hope that they understand the message, and have enough clout in the organization to raise these issues to be heard by the decision makers!

Is Trimble going to make a Win10 version of PowerCadd?

Me too. I started using PowerDraw (now PowerCADD) in 1989 on this project. The project was all hand drawn ink on mylar except I drew all the windows, skylights, and worked out a few other things with PowerDraw. By one year later, I all my drawing sheets were done in PowerDraw.

I keep saying PowerCADD is the program Layout dreams of being when it grows up. If it can’t be acquired, at least learn what’s so great about it. Alfred Scott’s Wild Tools plugin collection is half of what makes it so great.

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Hey @Adam,
Have you/did you track this subject thread?
If so, what is your response, to the “PowerCadd” potential to supplement LayOut in particular?

r2d22:
Asking for the impossible. Layout is pathetic in comparison to the cadd program (2D Mac only) PowerCadd which I have used for 31 years. Yesterday the developer, Todd Stanley, announced that it has no future, there will be no further development, this is an incredible shame. PowerCadd shares with SketchUp the elegance and ease of use we all have come to expect.
I do not know anything about coding but I do know elegance when I see it.
In my perfect world Trimble would acquire PowerCadd (at the moment it has no value) and would then begin to marry it to SketchUp with all its incredible features. I know that this is asking for the impossible but if you don’t believe in the impossible how do you ever expect it to happen.
SketchUp is amazing but what is lacking is the simplicity and ease of creating 2D drawing and Layout does not do it. This is based on the experience of producing 2D drawing for 31 years. I have been going between the two using .dwg export and import but it is not perfect.

Hi Rik,
I have also been at this “2D” Construction Drawing thing for at least 30 years, and I totally agree with your approach and idea …
Anyone who tries to use LayOut to produce Construction Documents at any scale knows we need serious improvements to stay competitive in today’s environment.
Trimble has clearly shown little interest to date in really making any serious investment in the LayOut program that would bring it up to current industry production standards. (Yes, there was the recent LayOut Petition, … but is there any tangible outcome or commitment from Trimble?)
So, if they can’t, and/or won’t improve LayOut , then PLEASE Trimble, let in someone or some other program (such as PowerCadd) that could solve this substantial, long standing, and built-in, production bottleneck.
Let’s hope someone at Trimble is actually paying attention to this discussion/thread. And let’s further hope that they understand the message, and have enough clout in the organization to raise these issues to be heard by the decision makers!

There are a number of things in development now since this thread and I am talking to Mark twice a month now in efforts to see more done to layout and sketchup for designers, which is essentially the target audience for sketchup and should be. We deserve better, I’m doing my best to try and get real results, soon. Already many things are happening from what I know since this petition. I share your frustration, this can’t be a “make a few more improvements” kind of thing. A lot needs to be improved and we need much more results much faster, this is what I’m pushing for and essentially trying to get the decision makers to realize more of the potential in these programs for designers. There is a lot that needs to be done, so far so good and the community will see the results when more responses come from trimble either through feedback from Mark or others in this thread or other threads, and or in new sketchup/layout releases.

  • Tucker
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Thanks ArayaCAD,
It’s interesting that you are talking with Mark, but you do not mention Adam, who I understand is the LayOut team leader? Has something changed recently? (Although several SU team members have mentioned in the past that Adam “doesn’t surface too often” … so, by all means, talk to who you CAN talk to!
I appreciate you following up on what the Trimble team evidently promised you/us as a result of the Petition …
Keep up the good work!
Bill

Thanks Bill! Yea I don’t know all of those specifics, I’m just pushing for change, I’m sure I’ll learn more and more as things go along. Mark has been kind enough to allow me to give direct feedback to him and it’s been going quite well so far. I’m pleased and looking forward to some of the upcoming changes.

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