ok, that makes sense. Everything has to have a thickness or it will show on both sides. I think that’s basically what I needed - I still don’t understand the z fighting with my fan grates but maybe because I was making them on a flat panel… got it, thanks for sticking with it…
@dezmo illustrated it way up there ^
I followed up by talking about things needing thickness.
No software can magically know what you want to show as inside or outside. Especially when lines have only length as a dimension and planes only length and width (no thickness).
A question about this if I may. Is there something somewhere that made you think that faces in SketchUp have thickness? I’m wondering if there’s some sort of educational materials somewhere that would have given you that impression. If seems pretty obvious to me that a face has zero thickness but I’m not a new user of SketchUp. If there is something out there, especially in SketchUp’s own training materials it would be a good idea to get it corrected.
The Real Aaron has a good Square One video on z-fighting. But his explanation was that 2 faces drawn from edges on a single plane share the same exact geolocated z-space. And while moving our view angle, the graphics card is not sure which face is nearer the camera (because they both share the same space) so the screen will show one face at a given angle and the other when moving to a different angle of view. Because it happens so quickly it looks like a flicker. So by giving each face a thickness (of physical distance) lets the graphics card always know which face is closest to the camera viewing angle, and reduces z-fighting.
This forum is Amazing for help, but you have not uploaded your model for us to look at. simply describing your problems with language takes way longer and leads to lots of misunderstandings. It is always quicker to upload a model. The “why” is impossible to tell you without an uploaded model unless we are standing over your shoulder watching you model, we’re guessing at what your core misunderstanding of the software might be. If someone says “my car won’t go” we have to ask many many questions to finally find out they didn’t know cars run on gasoline. Lots of us pros model all kinds of things and have to sell them and demonstrate them to clients and stakeholders all day long, big things and little things, it works great, it will work great for you once you understand it.
I don’t know if this is the same issue at the OP is describing, as they’ve not provided any images or files.
I’m not sure what the solution for this is, but it does happen - it’s to do with the way edges are rendered .The vertical lines here are the edges of an object behind a 2cm thick panel - SketchUp is rendering them despite this - no edges, no problem.
Attached is a deliberately created example file for others to see - maybe it doesn’t happen on all setups. It certainly won’t happen on all models - as It’s clearly a precision issue, but I don’t know what the solution is (if there is one)
lines.skp (169.4 KB)
Let me ask you this: if your oven was a real world object, sitting right in front of you, and you added a shelf to it, would you install the shelf from one outside corner to the other outside corner? Or would that shelf be on the inside of that oven?
Yup, looks like the software is functioning exactly how I’d expect it.
That “box in mind” you made: none of the sides have a thickness. If you built an actual box - say out of 3/4” plywood" - would that “shelf” go through each piece or would it be constrained by the interior dimensions of the box?
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If you’re going to be using CAD for your job, you need to learn about object and layer management. It isn’t just drawing shapes on a plane. I know groups and tags sounds boring, but I’ve been using CAD since 1996, learn these essentials (did your employer not offer training?).
nope training at work was done by other people who started learning the year prior. They were taught by one guy who also worked for our company and was mostly self taught.
Great, another ‘non-answer’ given in the form of a sarcastic ‘answer’. Who said I added the shelf from the outside? I didn’t add the shelf from the outside, I added it from the inside, which is why it didn’t make sense.
a face has infinite thinness - ok great. But how would a new user know that. I can see it right? I can put a hole in it right? I can ‘paint’ it right? Not having taken any ‘real’ classes, how would a person know whether the surface has ‘infinite thinness’?
And also, it seems the consensus here is that adding thickness and creating ‘panels’ solves my problem. Well, to the person who asked me what educational material might have led me astray - if I look up ‘panels’ it returns nothing about the type of panels being discussed.
I also did another ‘boxy’ model, this time giving all surfaces thickness. And guess what - half way through I started seeing lines bleeding through all over the place. I’m sure someone here will be happy to tell me what else I’m doing wrong? I would actually love to know so don’t be shy…
Wasn’t meaning to be sarcastic and your thinking its a “non-answer” is interesting. I was simply trying to convey a way for you to think about what you’re doing wrong…
I do hope you are able to obtain proper training in CAD but if you’re not willing to let yourself learn the core concepts, well, maybe you’ll figure it out…
I appreciate that, but as I’ve tried to explain before, my boss doesn’t want me or my colleagues posting pictures of what we’re doing. Trust me, it’s nothing exciting, and may not even be the right tool, but she’s concerned that if we post what we’re doing, our competitors will start to offer the same service. Personally I don’t think it’s a valid argument.
I’ll try to replicate it with a similar type example. thanks again.
As a self taught SketchUp user, like most people, this forum is invaluable for learning new things or getting help with problems. Whilst some people can come across as sarcastic or unhelpful, generally everyone is here to help.
Often things get “lost in translation” where there’s a language barrier or different terminology for things across different software(tags vs layers etc)
It might be that you’re stuck on something that seems simple to experienced users and they cant grasp what your issue actually is.
As you’ve already suggested, the best thing you can do is replicate the problem with a simple example and upload it here. That way people will 100% know what your issue is and how to help.
Share a similar model without sharing your top secret boxes that show this problem.
If you go back to my post above you will see that depending on viewing distance, style settings (profiles, etc.) and how thin the material is you may have issues. My framing model that I showed you way up thread is a great example.
But we also do not know if your model is done cleanly - IIRC your fan assembly was bleeding though because it was literally in the wrong place.
Until you post a model we will keep running round and round and guessing.
And until you decide to understand some of the basics of how 3d modeling works and is represented on a 2d screen and learn how to use tags and scenes to fluidly manage your modeling and presentations - you will continue to go round and round.
Good luck!
hi.
by the way, Dezmo gave you the link to the training center of Sketchup last week. in there you’ll find basic and advanced training on how sketchup works, not just the tools, but also the 3d logic.
Sketchup is a tool, it’s not as complex as many out there, but it’s still complex, and the best way to use it is to take the time to learn it.
the basis you’re missing right now is the fact that it behaves like real world. things have thickness, even a thin piece of paper (granted, not much).
In geometry, it is a common fact that points, lines and faces have no thickness, they are merely mathematical representations with coordinates.
same here 
If it makes sense, I would consider asking your boss to hire someone who can officially train you/the team under an NDA. Explain the cost of time when you guys are having to figure stuff out and how improved efficiency would improve profits. Honestly, just a fundamentals class that starts with what different drawing entities are, groups, solids, components (dynamic and static), tags, layer management, and scenes. It sounds like if you had someone who could effectively teach these it would give you a real boost up and you wouldn’t spend so much time being frustrated.
Thanks. I think some people are trying to help. In your 2 sentences, you both told me that I’m doing things “wrong”, and that I’m “not willing to learn the core concepts”. What I find “interesting” is that you think you’re teaching me something.
I wrote a long response but thought better of it.
I came here to ask for help to understand something that doesn’t make sense to me. If ‘experts’ don’t want me to ask questions, why do either of us come here? Is it to try to teach people what they know, or is it more about making some feel better about themselves? If we’re going to make assumptions, that’s the one I make - that some are more interested in making themselves feel better under the guise of ‘helping’ morons like me.
The thing I’ve basically learned here, is that I should use AI to try to get answers, or to watch every single Aaron video, or try to find in the books I’ve bought. Go to the forums if desperate.
an expert answered your question. he posted links to training material that would make things clearer. and you marked their answer as a solution 6 days ago.
Well, He has a point. your way of modelling is incorrect, and a week later you’re coming back to debate on semantics and bedside manners when you could have used the time to learn.
and Sailing Sketcher has a second point here :
yep. totally. some people are fine learning on their own with available ressources, some need a trainer and proper classes. it’s fine.
it’s more than fine, it’s my day job.
better bite the bullet and get a couple days of formal training so that you start on solid ground than reach out in the dark.
Yeah, I first started using CAD intermittently back in 1996 but I didn’t take a class until about 5 years later. That class - which was just an elective I was taking in college for an easy A - put me leaps and bounds ahead of where I was.
Something that could be helpful to incorporate into your workflow would be making all of your objects solids. You can think of solids (noted in entity info as “solid component” or “solid group”) as more realistic since they consist of a volume defined by an outer boundary of faces. This means that instead of using a single face for a rectangular panel, you would use Push/Pull to extrude the rectangular face (even just a few mm) and group it. I try to maintain solid status as much as I can (to the point that it’s excessive) in my modeling as it allows me to use the Solid Trim and Solid Union tools in a way that feels natural and realistic.